Now I start to appreciate what makes H fun to be with. I like the down to earth approach he has to keep the ego in check and not dwell on his and your little victories. That makes him appear even more expert on this field and allows you to focus on the work for the real good stuff.
Glad you're getting his strengths now, too. He was an incredible teacher in many regards. I learned so much and he ushered me through an intense spiritual opening for several years expertly.
I'm behind everyone else and thought what good would my comments be now. Then I realize probably and we hope so people will join this mission and will start at the beginning as I did.
So. NYC 2023 - H calling out of nowhere was a great turn for the story. I loved it. I loved Ari's comment "Whatever it is (than H wants) is good content." Then when we find out the H didn't call because he heard Schuyler was writing their story but he was just calling and then gets upset to hear Schuyler is telling it I thought who the hell is H anyway? I have no idea. Is H his name?
When we go back to 2009 I wondered if what Schuyler wrote about H's call is part of the "book" or not. I think it should be. Having writing the story create "story" made me wonder if that was part of what Katherine was talking about in Chapter 3.
Hello Dal! Yes your comments are totally welcome and I'm happy you decided to post. I appreciate you expressing your own thoughts and questions and also paving the way for those who come behind you--thank you twice over :) Time is very flexible in this project.
Yes, it was a real shock when H reached out. That is not his name. It's an initial I am using because I want to protect his identity.
As for who the hell he is...I like the question :) I hope you will understand as you read further. He's a spiritual teacher, Gurdjieff-inspired, I worked with for a number of years. He's one of the main characters in the story. He is also a real person, or so I think (see the exchange with A Very Harry here in the comments for more on that).
I'm drawn to this line: "And once, when it occurred to me that I had no way of knowing if H existed for anyone other than me"
I recall that in your first post, you expressed a similar sentiment. Here in the midst of the story, it makes sense, but I admit it was a little jarring to read it when you were writing as the Schuyler of the present day.
I have two questions:
1) What would it mean to "exist just for you?"
2) Do you still suspect that he is a figment of your imagination?
I ask these questions as someone fully sympathetic to the worldview of a mystic, as someone who wants to swim in the strange waters without drowning. (2) can be tested by talking to other people who knew H., but (1) is harder to test without clarifying what it means.
Hello! Thank you for the comment/questions! They have provoked good reflection in me...this is an important point. Maybe I'll riff and shed a little more light...
I find that it is hard to answer these questions without sounding a little vague or evasive. Thank you for evoking the mystical perspective. I think we need to speak here mystic to mystic :)
There will be a line in the next installment (this coming Friday) that will introduce this point again...is he real? and if so...in what way and for whom. I want to hold on to the mystery a little longer. It was a part of my experience in those days (roughly 2009-2011) that he did seem to exist in a parallel world, we met in a parallel world. The "ordinary world" seemed to slip away when I went to visit him. Sometimes it would start shifting as soon as I left the subway and sometimes it was when I entered his small office. When I left him, there was also an almost-palpable state shift. I would "come down to earth" again. So, I did wonder if he also existed here on this plane. At the end of the day, I do believe he does ;) And I do know others who know him. Some of it is a symptom of how much projection I was doing at that time, and how intense the awakening experience was for me. It was ...confusing at times. Maybe you know this experience, too?
I also sort of enjoyed feeling like he was in or from another dimension. He seemed timeless or (as I said) even extraterrestrial. Part of what I am exploring in the writing of the story and SHARING it is the question of whether or not I was under a spell and if so what kind and was it benevolent and helpful and what is Reality anyway :) Small questions, right?? In a way, we are under a spell much of the time. This one had a particularly rich texture.
Of course, seeing him as an ordinary man with a background, a mom and dad, a house and bills to pay, kids to take to school, laundry to do and errands to run etc...was hard for me and it does take away from the air of mystery. WHICH he did cultivate intentionally. He said very, very little about his life before I met him and his life outside of our time together. Interestingly, Gurdjieff did the same thing. His background including where he was born and when and his travels etc...all of that was a mystery and intentionally obscured. He liked to "lie" and "act" and trick people. Something about the destabilization seems like it was helpful to his persona and The Work. Maybe H learned this from Gurdjieff. Maybe he was Gurdjieff. They are very similar as you will continue to see.
One more anecdote--ONCE and only once I took a friend to see H. It was the only time I sat in his home (not his office) with a witness. As we left and felt the rush of the NYC street again, my friend was blown away and said, "You know that scene in the Matrix where Neo meets the Oracle and she's not actually real outside that apartment? That's what I feel like he is...He's like that."
I think seeing him as a man who exists as we all do might be important to this integration and reflection process. But the person I was when I was working with him was truly not sure. She often thought he was there for her and she also didn't speak about her work with him to anyone. The secrecy helped to keep our work charged, intimate, private and kind of otherworldly. Does this help?
Yes, reveal the mysteries at the pace that feels right to you :)
It very much makes sense to me the state shift that would happen and how the transition would begin even before entering the office. To answer your question, I do not think that is something that I have quite experienced. I have had a fair share of... non-ordinary experiences, but I have never had a routine that guaranteed a regularity to them. They pop in unexpected, which I would imagine that you could relate to as well.
I sensed that it was enjoyable to feel that he's otherworldly or just for you. That's part of what motivated the question. From experience I know that ideas that make us feel special are especially easy to believe. Forgive me if this getting way up in your business as a complete stranger. I am attempting to run with the spirit of this experiment. To even the playing field of vulnerability I'll share this: I have a messiah complex. It's very easy for my mind skip down and down this rabbit hole of thought that I am a Christ Neo of extraordinary power. Even if it were true, it's still an unhealthy thought at this point in my evolution because it makes the next obstacle feel like a crushing blow to my self esteem, like "Oh so I am an avatar of Christ, but I'm terrified to ask my neighbor to turn his music down? Some messiah..."
I love this idea of exploring whether it was a spell. I am especially interested in the question of if a spell can be benevolent. Personally I would be interested in the question of what would a healthy process of obtaining consent before a spell look like.
Yes, this post helps. Thank you so much for the detailed reply.
I can definitely see how the air of mystery would lend itself to the work. And how keeping it private would keep it charged. Magic seems to fluorish in the dark. The more cameras, the less magic. This is a concept I have been playing with for a couple weeks now.
I will conclude by sharing some examples of this concept I have identified in my own life and in my studies of physics.
a) The wave function can only evolve when you're not looking at it
b) Furthermore a quantum computer only works when the wave function is not collapsed
d) The interference pattern in the double slit experiment only appears when you don't look at the electrons (or photons or whichever specific instantiation of the double slit experiment we're talking about
d) Stories are filled much more wonder when told in the dark
e) When I put my music on shuffle and a song comes on that I can't pinpoint the artist, I enjoy it more. Something about the song takes on this delicious moment-to-momentedness where each note or instrument feels like another little pleasure. If I give in and glance at the artist, the magic dissipates. It's almost like when I look at the artist, the song gets filed into my pre-existing category structure of "This music is good, this music is bad, this artist is funky, that artist is mainstream, etc. etc." which reduces my ability to appreciate the quality of the song.
f) The quantum foam like freaks out when you try to look too closely at it because of the Heisenberg uncertainty principle
g) When someone is looking at me intently to gauge my reaction, I lose the ability to be spontaneous
Bravo physics! What a cool science :) FULL of mystery, seduction, coyness. I really enjoyed your examples. Love this one: d) Stories are filled much more wonder when told in the dark. So true!
I also laughed at your messiah can't tell the neighbor to turn the music down moment. It felt like a Far Side comic. And I appreciate you running with the spirit of the experiment and sharing your own easy-to-believe messiah complex. I bet this is more common than any of us like to admit. We ARE special, each of us, and sadly a lot of us weren't recognized as such or treated that way...truly SEEN and FELT as remarkable. I long to give that to people. Thank you for your engagement. XO
They are only strong because we're on own knees. Said Etienne de la Boetie, when he was 16 years old.
And this passage where H hangs up and you say :
" I felt I’d retrieved the power I’d projected onto him all those years ago, and reclaimed the values I had compromised. I felt an old chapter of my life come to a close. But, I also felt a new freedom to express myself open...a new chapter beginning. "
That's exactly what it feels when you see the man is just a man and you are immune to his charisma. You are a woman in your prime and his manipulations have no hold now.
I wonder if that's what make older men go for younger women...
Once you mature a bit it can be one as easy as that.
Now I start to appreciate what makes H fun to be with. I like the down to earth approach he has to keep the ego in check and not dwell on his and your little victories. That makes him appear even more expert on this field and allows you to focus on the work for the real good stuff.
I guess so far so good.
Glad you're getting his strengths now, too. He was an incredible teacher in many regards. I learned so much and he ushered me through an intense spiritual opening for several years expertly.
I'm behind everyone else and thought what good would my comments be now. Then I realize probably and we hope so people will join this mission and will start at the beginning as I did.
So. NYC 2023 - H calling out of nowhere was a great turn for the story. I loved it. I loved Ari's comment "Whatever it is (than H wants) is good content." Then when we find out the H didn't call because he heard Schuyler was writing their story but he was just calling and then gets upset to hear Schuyler is telling it I thought who the hell is H anyway? I have no idea. Is H his name?
When we go back to 2009 I wondered if what Schuyler wrote about H's call is part of the "book" or not. I think it should be. Having writing the story create "story" made me wonder if that was part of what Katherine was talking about in Chapter 3.
Hello Dal! Yes your comments are totally welcome and I'm happy you decided to post. I appreciate you expressing your own thoughts and questions and also paving the way for those who come behind you--thank you twice over :) Time is very flexible in this project.
Yes, it was a real shock when H reached out. That is not his name. It's an initial I am using because I want to protect his identity.
As for who the hell he is...I like the question :) I hope you will understand as you read further. He's a spiritual teacher, Gurdjieff-inspired, I worked with for a number of years. He's one of the main characters in the story. He is also a real person, or so I think (see the exchange with A Very Harry here in the comments for more on that).
Thanks for reading. Keep 'em coming :)
Hi Schuyler, these are such a pleasure to read.
I'm drawn to this line: "And once, when it occurred to me that I had no way of knowing if H existed for anyone other than me"
I recall that in your first post, you expressed a similar sentiment. Here in the midst of the story, it makes sense, but I admit it was a little jarring to read it when you were writing as the Schuyler of the present day.
I have two questions:
1) What would it mean to "exist just for you?"
2) Do you still suspect that he is a figment of your imagination?
I ask these questions as someone fully sympathetic to the worldview of a mystic, as someone who wants to swim in the strange waters without drowning. (2) can be tested by talking to other people who knew H., but (1) is harder to test without clarifying what it means.
Hello! Thank you for the comment/questions! They have provoked good reflection in me...this is an important point. Maybe I'll riff and shed a little more light...
I find that it is hard to answer these questions without sounding a little vague or evasive. Thank you for evoking the mystical perspective. I think we need to speak here mystic to mystic :)
There will be a line in the next installment (this coming Friday) that will introduce this point again...is he real? and if so...in what way and for whom. I want to hold on to the mystery a little longer. It was a part of my experience in those days (roughly 2009-2011) that he did seem to exist in a parallel world, we met in a parallel world. The "ordinary world" seemed to slip away when I went to visit him. Sometimes it would start shifting as soon as I left the subway and sometimes it was when I entered his small office. When I left him, there was also an almost-palpable state shift. I would "come down to earth" again. So, I did wonder if he also existed here on this plane. At the end of the day, I do believe he does ;) And I do know others who know him. Some of it is a symptom of how much projection I was doing at that time, and how intense the awakening experience was for me. It was ...confusing at times. Maybe you know this experience, too?
I also sort of enjoyed feeling like he was in or from another dimension. He seemed timeless or (as I said) even extraterrestrial. Part of what I am exploring in the writing of the story and SHARING it is the question of whether or not I was under a spell and if so what kind and was it benevolent and helpful and what is Reality anyway :) Small questions, right?? In a way, we are under a spell much of the time. This one had a particularly rich texture.
Of course, seeing him as an ordinary man with a background, a mom and dad, a house and bills to pay, kids to take to school, laundry to do and errands to run etc...was hard for me and it does take away from the air of mystery. WHICH he did cultivate intentionally. He said very, very little about his life before I met him and his life outside of our time together. Interestingly, Gurdjieff did the same thing. His background including where he was born and when and his travels etc...all of that was a mystery and intentionally obscured. He liked to "lie" and "act" and trick people. Something about the destabilization seems like it was helpful to his persona and The Work. Maybe H learned this from Gurdjieff. Maybe he was Gurdjieff. They are very similar as you will continue to see.
One more anecdote--ONCE and only once I took a friend to see H. It was the only time I sat in his home (not his office) with a witness. As we left and felt the rush of the NYC street again, my friend was blown away and said, "You know that scene in the Matrix where Neo meets the Oracle and she's not actually real outside that apartment? That's what I feel like he is...He's like that."
I think seeing him as a man who exists as we all do might be important to this integration and reflection process. But the person I was when I was working with him was truly not sure. She often thought he was there for her and she also didn't speak about her work with him to anyone. The secrecy helped to keep our work charged, intimate, private and kind of otherworldly. Does this help?
Yes, reveal the mysteries at the pace that feels right to you :)
It very much makes sense to me the state shift that would happen and how the transition would begin even before entering the office. To answer your question, I do not think that is something that I have quite experienced. I have had a fair share of... non-ordinary experiences, but I have never had a routine that guaranteed a regularity to them. They pop in unexpected, which I would imagine that you could relate to as well.
I sensed that it was enjoyable to feel that he's otherworldly or just for you. That's part of what motivated the question. From experience I know that ideas that make us feel special are especially easy to believe. Forgive me if this getting way up in your business as a complete stranger. I am attempting to run with the spirit of this experiment. To even the playing field of vulnerability I'll share this: I have a messiah complex. It's very easy for my mind skip down and down this rabbit hole of thought that I am a Christ Neo of extraordinary power. Even if it were true, it's still an unhealthy thought at this point in my evolution because it makes the next obstacle feel like a crushing blow to my self esteem, like "Oh so I am an avatar of Christ, but I'm terrified to ask my neighbor to turn his music down? Some messiah..."
I love this idea of exploring whether it was a spell. I am especially interested in the question of if a spell can be benevolent. Personally I would be interested in the question of what would a healthy process of obtaining consent before a spell look like.
Yes, this post helps. Thank you so much for the detailed reply.
I can definitely see how the air of mystery would lend itself to the work. And how keeping it private would keep it charged. Magic seems to fluorish in the dark. The more cameras, the less magic. This is a concept I have been playing with for a couple weeks now.
I will conclude by sharing some examples of this concept I have identified in my own life and in my studies of physics.
a) The wave function can only evolve when you're not looking at it
b) Furthermore a quantum computer only works when the wave function is not collapsed
d) The interference pattern in the double slit experiment only appears when you don't look at the electrons (or photons or whichever specific instantiation of the double slit experiment we're talking about
d) Stories are filled much more wonder when told in the dark
e) When I put my music on shuffle and a song comes on that I can't pinpoint the artist, I enjoy it more. Something about the song takes on this delicious moment-to-momentedness where each note or instrument feels like another little pleasure. If I give in and glance at the artist, the magic dissipates. It's almost like when I look at the artist, the song gets filed into my pre-existing category structure of "This music is good, this music is bad, this artist is funky, that artist is mainstream, etc. etc." which reduces my ability to appreciate the quality of the song.
f) The quantum foam like freaks out when you try to look too closely at it because of the Heisenberg uncertainty principle
g) When someone is looking at me intently to gauge my reaction, I lose the ability to be spontaneous
Bravo physics! What a cool science :) FULL of mystery, seduction, coyness. I really enjoyed your examples. Love this one: d) Stories are filled much more wonder when told in the dark. So true!
I also laughed at your messiah can't tell the neighbor to turn the music down moment. It felt like a Far Side comic. And I appreciate you running with the spirit of the experiment and sharing your own easy-to-believe messiah complex. I bet this is more common than any of us like to admit. We ARE special, each of us, and sadly a lot of us weren't recognized as such or treated that way...truly SEEN and FELT as remarkable. I long to give that to people. Thank you for your engagement. XO
Indeed, what is one to make of being divine in a mundane world?
Bravo to you for writing these.
They are only strong because we're on own knees. Said Etienne de la Boetie, when he was 16 years old.
And this passage where H hangs up and you say :
" I felt I’d retrieved the power I’d projected onto him all those years ago, and reclaimed the values I had compromised. I felt an old chapter of my life come to a close. But, I also felt a new freedom to express myself open...a new chapter beginning. "
That's exactly what it feels when you see the man is just a man and you are immune to his charisma. You are a woman in your prime and his manipulations have no hold now.
I wonder if that's what make older men go for younger women...
Once you mature a bit it can be one as easy as that.